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Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

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RachelM
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby RachelM » Thu Feb 23, 2017 5:30 pm

I've got a two-burner Coleman stove, used for camping. I keep it stored in a large plastic tub along with the small propane tanks and all of my camp kitchen supplies. I love it. Some of the tanks are several years old as I haven't used them. I do believe you can hook it up to a larger bbq-sized tank with an adapter.
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jonesy
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby jonesy » Sun Mar 05, 2017 1:35 am

And the container it's in will degrade before the actual propane does:)

Best shelf life going!
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby CanCricket » Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:29 pm

Is there any chance of leakage of gas from the small propane tanks while they're being stored?
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby peppercorn » Sun Mar 12, 2017 5:22 am

I use these tanks all the time for many things including blow torches, It is as close to zero chance as anything is. First its not something that can happen unnoticed, There is a chemical put in that stinks, even a little tiny leak will be noticed night away, you cant really mistake the smell for anything other than a leak..2nd I have never ever heard of a store bought tank leaking. They know these are sold to the general public who will do the dumbest things such as placing them on the dash of the car on a hot summers day....they are underfilled and have over pressure venting. They are built to take the worst things you can (likely) do to them, not that you should try!!

Now with that said, the above applies to new store bought ones....if you refill them as I do you will in time , if its a very old tank or if its been left outside exposed the elements, encounter the odd one that might leak, I had one slow leak ,from the over pressure vent, it was a very old tank, had been left outside for I don't know how many years,and had rust in many places. You cant miss even a slow leak cause it stinks and hisses. If you go on you tube you will find lots of vids of people refilling tanks by different methods and usually measuring the tank weight to match the same fill amount as they come new. A very smart and I will say correct way to do such a thing....I don't do it that way.. I fill the whole tank right full of liquid propane, when I am done you can shake the can and not feel any sloshing around of propane, and the tank clearly feels heavier than a store bought one. I am not saying this is the right way, I am saying just to indicate how strong they are, even likely over filled by maybe as much as 15-20% I have not had a leak other than from the rusted up one that I should have known better than try to refill.

And if my memory serves me correct I think one other guy who refills his tanks mentioned that he had one (old) tank leak from the over pressure vent, but again a very old tank refilled who knows how many times or under what conditions. Use new tanks with 99.9999999999999999% confidence. I would say 100% but that violates my rule of being 100 % certain of anything, always have some doubt
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Nagol
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby Nagol » Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:47 am

The chemical is actually a gas itself called mercaptan.
Even a minor leak is easy to recognize. And god help you if you get liquid mercaptan on you. Its hell to get the stink off.

As for filling the tanks.
Do NOT fill to 100% liquid.
1. You are removing the necessary expansion room for the gas.
2. You risk feeding liquid into your appliance, not something you want to do. It will burn out the equipment in short order. And you risk freezing the diaphragm in the regulator.

For the larger tanks, there is an internal safety to be aware of. If you open the valve too quickly the internal safety will trip and stop the flow of gas. You can't reset it at home.

There is very little risk in storing tanks in the house but if your tanks reach the point where they are rusting or the date on the larger tanks has passed, spend the money and replace them, they are dated for a reason.

20 years and 3rd generation in gas work.
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby peppercorn » Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:54 am

Nagol wrote:The chemical is actually a gas itself called mercaptan.
Even a minor leak is easy to recognize. And god help you if you get liquid mercaptan on you. Its hell to get the stink off.

As for filling the tanks.
Do NOT fill to 100% liquid.
1. You are removing the necessary expansion room for the gas.
2. You risk feeding liquid into your appliance, not something you want to do. It will burn out the equipment in short order. And you risk freezing the diaphragm in the regulator.

For the larger tanks, there is an internal safety to be aware of. If you open the valve too quickly the internal safety will trip and stop the flow of gas. You can't reset it at home.

There is very little risk in storing tanks in the house but if your tanks reach the point where they are rusting or the date on the larger tanks has passed, spend the money and replace them, they are dated for a reason.

20 years and 3rd generation in gas work.
.

I do not disagree with Nagol , do not do what I do. I am a risk taker, I like living on the ragged edge, I wish to be a free man, and except the consequences of doing so.... I push things to the point of failure...its my nature, Its how I learn. With that said I take exception with one thing only that Nagol has said, and that's regarding the Best before date on tanks.......I have tanks 100#ers with a 1946 or 7 date stamp, rusted in places on the outside yes, other wise perfect. I have found expiry dates to be BS, I have tanks also expired from the 1980s that I regularly refill. I have cut propane tanks in half, in fact I have others from the 1940s, 50s, that I would be happy to cut open on camera so others can see the inside. Propane is a natural moisture displacement medium. I have never cut open a propane tank that had any internal corrosion, in fact they are perfect inside, or such has been my experience. Nagol please cut one open on camera so that others can see what I am saying. A visual examination to the outside in my opionon is all you need to evaluate a tank, deep rust pits are ofcourse a bad sign and likely a indicator that its time to send the tank to the junk yard. Though I need to qualify that by repeating deep rust pits!! .. as propane believe it or not is really not high pressure, the co2 tank for your pellet gun has maybe 3 or 4 times the pressure (depending on temp), of a propane tank,

50 +++ years of doing things until they puck up....who are you going to trust (jk)
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Nagol
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby Nagol » Sun Mar 12, 2017 12:35 pm

The dates stamped on the tanks are not actually expired dates but "inspection" dates. I own tanks for various gasses which have been in service and redated several times.
For the rust, I should have been clear that I was referring to severe pitting and not surface oxidization. I have seen tanks survive fires and have old tanks myself.
I have a few burners which still use the "old" internally threaded valves.

High pressure is a relative term. Nitrogen is stored at high pressure (20 000psi), Propane anywhere from 1-20lbs depending on the application(more on commercial applications).
When talking about LP or NG anything over 1lb is considered high pressure as equipment runs off of 8"wc and 3.5"wc respectively.

In general, gas is less dangerous than most people think, the combustion potential exists in a 7%(NG) and 9%(LP) air/fuel ratio range. I may be off 1%, haven't had to look up the ranges in years.


My suggestions were meant more to side on caution then what will work in a pinch. In my opinion for the sake of a few $$ now it's worth it to keep equipment you depend on current to avoid issues when no replacements are available. Its all personal in the end, no offence taken and no doubt you've had success.
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Danux
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby Danux » Thu Jul 20, 2017 6:46 pm

On a different note, I just finished of a green bottle of propane, after almost two summers of sporadic use. I use a single burner and round base type of stove, find that most others who use/borrow it will light the burner and just crank gas up as high as possible, which is a total waste. I use mine in a still environment, and burn it as low as possible. It takes a little longer to, say, bring water to a boil, but the propane lasts so much longer.

.
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Wayne
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby Wayne » Sat Jul 22, 2017 1:58 pm

Propane is ideally stored outside. It's interesting that in Australia, the law allows storage of 10 Kg of bottle storage indoors (Home) and 15 Kg in any business. I store four 10 kg bottles inside. I discussed this with a fireman friend of mine some time back. He didn't think that their was any appreciable degree of hazard as long as the cylinders were in good condition (mine are new), tested for leaks prior to storage, and stored in a safe area (away from any chance of impact), kept cool and dry, and inspected periodically.

I realize that this may pose as a risk. In my opinion however, this risk is minimal. I also store other potentially dangerous items (firearms, combustibles, etc.) in a safe manner. Propane is but one of these.
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jonesy
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Re: Storing Propane Tanks/Cooking During a Power Outage

Postby jonesy » Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:17 pm

Nagol wrote:There is very little risk in storing tanks in the house but if your tanks reach the point where they are rusting or the date on the larger tanks has passed, spend the money and replace them, they are dated for a reason.



With the tank exchange, (Petro Can, Wal Mart, CT, etc.) the new , freshly painted tank is part of the deal. And they will accept ANY old tank.

Jonesy
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